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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I've got 44,000 miles on a 2016 Canyon. In the last 2,000 miles, it's left me stranded twice due to the emissions nonsense. First was a SCR issue and now I have a possibly clogged or bad DPF. I do mostly long highway trips and need something that is very reliable. I am 4,000 miles from my GM CPO warranty from expiring.

FWIW, currently my DPF % is over 200% and it won't regen at all. I can't go over 40MPH right now. I'm hoping the turbo was not damaged or at least everything can be fixed in the next 4,000 miles.

I would delete and tune with no reservations but worry about the tune's performance enhancements causing other unintended problems in the future. I don't want better performance and just want to turn off the EGR and tell the ECM to stop worrying about the SCR and DPF systems. Does such a plain vanilla tune exist?

Although it would cost me quite a bit, should I just trade and get a gas engine truck? I'd really hate to do it.
 

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This is really sad to hear. While I cannot offer any experienced suggestions, there are many who have deleted and have no issues. You have really low miles on your truck and if you can delete in your area it might be the option to pursue. There are many threads on the topic and I am sure someone will chime in to help. Best of luck!
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Appreciate that. Assuming I can find the right tune, I am hoping I can also find a way to just remove the DPF and leave the rest of the physical exhaust system in place. It's surprising to me I've had trouble. I get DEF at truck stop pumps to be sure it's fresh to avoid SCR problems. I don't do a lot of city driving and never had the "keep driving" message at all - until a regen just couldn't start in the first place.
 

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Delete it if you like the truck otherwise. American Diesel Power sells tunes from hACKman’s Customs. His tunes aren’t high horsepower tunes. They provide a good boost of performance and drive ability to the truck which is much needed. But they are well within the safe limits of what the truck will handle. So you won’t have to worry about putting too much hp or torque to the transmission and have it go kaput.

I deleted at like 46k and have 25k+ miles on the truck now and no issues. Constantly get 29+ mpg (hand figured) on the highway. It’s worth it.

To your point about keeping the stock exhaust but removing the DPF. You could probably cut it out and weld in a piece of straight pipe. But why do you want to do that is my question? Why not just get a new whole next exhaust with muffler?
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Thanks. I will check out American Diesel Power.

I haven't really thought about the exhaust change much. I guess a new exhaust would be easier and would be easier to put back if I went to trade it at a dealer later on.
 

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Thanks. I will check out American Diesel Power.

I haven't really thought about the exhaust change much. I guess a new exhaust would be easier and would be easier to put back if I went to trade it at a dealer later on.
I just cut the DPF off and welded a piece of 3 inch pipe in it's place. If I ever want to return to stock I'll just weld it back in. Cost $40 vs $400 for a whole new exhaust and sounds pretty much the same. As far as tune goes I have GDE and am very happy with it.
 

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i just bought a downpipe back aFe exhaust with muffler for $493. the workmanship is beautiful and i plan to tune and delete and install it when i get home in mid october. i'd like to be able to put everything back stock if i want to but very much doubt i will ever do that.

i have thought much about the tune/delete options and now agree with burgess and others that it is the thing to do. in addition to the obvious performance improvements, it seems very likely that it will increase the reliability, longevity, and fuel efficiency of the engine. i am in norway right now where all the environmental standards are super strict; water, air, recycling, etc and yet they have many many diesels and they don't require the same emissions controls as USA does. Why? Here's what I think and I welcome discussion.
1) the europeans have concluded that the emissions from a well engineered, well built diesel engine do not present a big enough health or environmental concern to justify the expense, loss in reliability, and increased fuel consumption USA diesels are forced to contend with.
2) so much of USA standards are dictated by industry forces, not good sense. in this case, i am willing to bet that the big auto makers were able to force these standards thru congress because they realized it would give them a monopoly on selling small diesels in the US.

as a long time toyota fan, i would have jumped at purchasing a toyota hilux diesel rather than the colorado if only i could get one and license it in us. similarly, the europeans have a huge range of small trucks, suvs, and wonderful RVs, none of which are license-able in the US. can you imagine how much different the diesel landscape would be in the us if not for the crushing emissions standards?

how much do the us diesel emissions standards actually cost us (environmentally and economically) when you factor in increased fuel consumption, decreased engine life, increased maintenance and engine parts failures, etc.?

as i thought this through, i came to the conclusion that deleting is a sensible approach to this madness and intend to do it as soon as i can. i love my colorado diesel and i want it to last as long and be as trouble-free as possible, just like all of us.

thoughts?
 

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I've got 44,000 miles on a 2016 Canyon. In the last 2,000 miles, it's left me stranded twice due to the emissions nonsense. First was a SCR issue and now I have a possibly clogged or bad DPF. I do mostly long highway trips and need something that is very reliable. I am 4,000 miles from my GM CPO warranty from expiring.

FWIW, currently my DPF % is over 200% and it won't regen at all. I can't go over 40MPH right now. I'm hoping the turbo was not damaged or at least everything can be fixed in the next 4,000 miles.

I would delete and tune with no reservations but worry about the tune's performance enhancements causing other unintended problems in the future. I don't want better performance and just want to turn off the EGR and tell the ECM to stop worrying about the SCR and DPF systems. Does such a plain vanilla tune exist?

Although it would cost me quite a bit, should I just trade and get a gas engine truck? I'd really hate to do it.
Are you happy with the truck? Does it meet all your needs? Do you live where you can do a complete delete? Are you OK with never trading in at a dealer as no longer compliant?
If the answer to all is yes, then do a GDE off-road delete and carry on.
If the answer is no to any of the above, have it repaired under warranty and buy a gas truck.
 

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i have thought much about the tune/delete options and now agree with burgess and others that it is the thing to do. in addition to the obvious performance improvements, it seems very likely that it will increase the reliability, longevity, and fuel efficiency of the engine. i am in norway right now where all the environmental standards are super strict; water, air, recycling, etc and yet they have many many diesels and they don't require the same emissions controls as USA does. Why? Here's what I think and I welcome discussion.
I'm still curious about the effect of doing a tune and delete on emissions. How much, if at all, does tuning increase emissions? I'm not too convinced by opinions but would really be interested in test results if they exist (and kind of suspect they don't).
 

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I'm still curious about the effect of doing a tune and delete on emissions. How much, if at all, does tuning increase emissions? I'm not too convinced by opinions but would really be interested in test results if they exist (and kind of suspect they don't).
It's a trade off between types of emissions and there are three major types with diesel. Carbon monoxide, soot, and oxides of nitrogen.

Carbon monoxide is a greenhouse gas, and is reduced by raising combustion temperatures.

Soot, or particulate matter, is produced by incomplete combustion and is claimed to be linked to respiratory issues in humans and other animals.

Oxides of nitrogen are produced at high combustion temperatures, which are what creates acid rain.

Most tuners tune to raise combustion temperature and for the most complete burn which reduces soot. However, they completely ignore oxides of nitrogen emissions.

Volkswagen emission scandal involved emitting 10-40 times the allowable oxides of nitrogen emissions during DPF regeneration.

Considering the emissions controls weren't completely disabled, you can assume that a tuned truck will be on the higher end of that range. And a deleted and tuned truck will not only produce more NOx, they will also emit more soot.

Emissions tests are expensive, so tuners typically have no interest in testing the impact of their tunes on emissions.
 

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but, the higher combustion temps and lack of regens also should increase the fuel efficiency so there is that positive tradeoff of burning less fuel per mile that partially cancels the negative effects of more NOX.
 

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but, the higher combustion temps and lack of regens also should increase the fuel efficiency so there is that positive tradeoff of burning less fuel per mile that partially cancels the negative effects of more NOX.
The math doesn't quite work out... 15% better mileage, 1000-4000% more emissions...
 

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it sounded like increased combustion temps should reduce soot and carbon monoxide emissions, while allowing NOX emissions to increase, right? the removal of particulate filter should allow an increase in soot emissions but that is somewhat offset (and, i don't know the actual numbers) by increased burning efficiency of higher combustion temps. to me, it seems to make sense to have more efficient combustion burning up the spot in the first place rather than inefficient combustion necessitating the removal of particles later. i also question the long-term environmental and financial costs from the reduced reliability and longevity that comes part and parcel with the emissions systems. if you have to replace engines typicallyin 150K rather than 500K, that should be factored in too, don't you think?

i am curious if you have a reference for that 1000-4000% increase you cite? that sounds pretty extreme and it makes me wonder why the europeans, who are typically more environmentally and health conscious than US citizens (yes, i know a big generalization...) would allow such horrendous emissions when technology exists to reduce them?
 

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it sounded like increased combustion temps should reduce soot and carbon monoxide emissions, while allowing NOX emissions to increase, right? the removal of particulate filter should allow an increase in soot emissions but that is somewhat offset (and, i don't know the actual numbers) by increased burning efficiency of higher combustion temps. to me, it seems to make sense to have more efficient combustion burning up the spot in the first place rather than inefficient combustion necessitating the removal of particles later. i also question the long-term environmental and financial costs from the reduced reliability and longevity that comes part and parcel with the emissions systems. if you have to replace engines typicallyin 150K rather than 500K, that should be factored in too, don't you think?

i am curious if you have a reference for that 1000-4000% increase you cite? that sounds pretty extreme and it makes me wonder why the europeans, who are typically more environmentally and health conscious than US citizens (yes, i know a big generalization...) would allow such horrendous emissions when technology exists to reduce them?
The short answer is that they don't. European countries have DPF and SCR systems as well. However, different countries have had different opinions on what "allowable levels" should be. The gaps are closing, however.

The 1000-4000% increase in emissions is based on the 10-40 times the allowable levels that VW TDI vehicles were found to emit in their whole scandal.

For the most part, emissions systems don't reduce engine life. Everything that happens with SCR and DPF occurs outside of the engine. The exception is EGR, which is a technology that should die immediately. Recirculating exhaust, into the intake to reduce combustion temps because it's inert is effective at doing so, but especially harmful with diesel due to the soot content of the exhaust.

If/when I modify mine, I will likely eliminate EGR first.
 

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so then your approach would be to just tune and remove or block the egr?
GDE's tune doesn't remove or block the EGR valve, in fact it even cycles it at startup to keep it from getting stuck, but the disable it with their changes to the software so exhaust is never recirculated.

Once the power train warranty is over, I'll likely buy their tune.
 
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