[Hutch]

http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/76.../177728-lubricity-additive-study-results.html

 

[CleverUserName]

Ancient. This study is 11 years old, and done when ULSD was new and B5 was the only viable alternative. Back in 2007 when people were adding ATF to their 6BT fuel tank to add lubricity, lots has changed back then.

Also, this assumes that none of these additives have been reformulated since 2007. I think it's highly likely that most or all of them have been...

And as a side note, I met the original owner of the Diesel Place site. He lives near Sacramento, CA. http://www.nicktane.com/

 

[Hutch]

Southwest Research Institute performed the study and not the original owner of the Diesel Place site. Tell us what or which has changed or improved, please. What do you prefer, or do you use a fuel additive? Many diesel owners don't think an additive is necessary for engine longevity. Synthetic lubricants have been around since well before 2007. I suspect there have been improvements. Using high quality engine oil is very important for engine longevity. Before servo speed control was added to keep engine rpms constant at idle, changing from regular motor oil to synthetic motor oil raised the rpms at idle. The rpms would rise as much as 200 rpm because of the reduction of friction. Noticed this on a dirt track racing engine.

The following organization performed the study, long ago:

https://www.swri.org/technical-divisions/fuels-lubricants-research

Chemistry doesn't change real fast. My uncle tested oil lubricity back in the 1950s and I noticed on youtube videos recently, some are still doing the test the same way.

You say, "lots has changed back then." Do you mean a lot has changed since then?

Thanks for your very informative reply and technical information!

 

[CleverUserName]

Southwest Research Institute performed the study and not the original owner of the Diesel Place site. Tell us what or which has changed or improved, please. What do you prefer, or do you use a fuel additive? Many diesel owners don't think an additive is necessary for engine longevity. Synthetic lubricants have been around since well before 2007. I suspect there have been improvements. Using high quality engine oil is very important for engine longevity. Before servo speed control was added to keep engine rpms constant at idle, changing from regular motor oil to synthetic motor oil raised the rpms at idle. The rpms would rise as much as 200 rpm because of the reduction of friction. Noticed this on a dirt track racing engine.

The following organization performed the study, long ago:

https://www.swri.org/technical-divisions/fuels-lubricants-research

Chemistry doesn't change real fast. My uncle tested oil lubricity back in the 1950s and I noticed on youtube videos recently, some are still doing the test the same way.

You say, "lots has changed back then." Do you mean a lot has changed since then?

Thanks for your very informative reply and technical information!

The testing itself is to an ASTM or similar standard. That usually doesn't change. The Diesel Place and users financed the testing, but that really isn't the point.

Modern synthetics are better than ever, and modern conventional oils rival synthetics in every way except volatility and resistance to oxidation.

Oil formulations change frequently. An oil sold under an API or ACEA umbrella may change many times in it's lifetime, unbeknownst to the users. With the same logic, I think it's naive to assume that none of these additive formulas analyzed in this test have changed their ingredients or constituents in the last 11 years. I'm sure some of them have, for better or for worse. Just like Oil formulations, when cost of materials goes up, a choice is made. Raise the price, use less of the expensive ingredients, or substitute another, cheaper ingredient which may have similar properties.

Yes I use an diesel fuel additives. Stanadyne performance formula in the winter and Amalgamated TDR-FL in the summer. Stanadyne PF is the only additve that has multiple OEM approvals so I think it is all around a good product, but it I'd like to find another option to Stanadyne as I believe it is too strong and solvent based for prolonged use. I have a bunch of it purchased many years ago and I just use it for the winter months. It rarely gets below 30 deg F and no colder than 20 F here so I probably don't even need anti-gel, but it gives me piece of mind.

I've been using HVO as fuel for ~ 9 months in both my HPCR diesels. It is a high quality D#2 substitute, however it is a very dry fuel, supposedly is additized to HFRR 460. I don't think 2-EHN and other combustion improvers have much of an effect, if any on this fuel's properties either. But I use it for the other benefits which may or may not still apply. I've used additives for the last 10 years. Additives have a much greater effect on poorer quality fuels, so it all relative to what you're mixing it with.

"Lots" could refer to manufacturing lots, but it's just a typo. Alot has changed since then and most people don't add ATF or 2 stroke oil to ULSD#2 anymore because it does very little if anything to improve the fuel.

 

[EKarlW]

Well this is another fine mess this board has gotten me into! Since I don't believe much anymore with out checking things out because of bias due to marketing, limited research/user experience etc. I wandered down this rat-hole filled with snake oil and such and here is where I'm at (NOTE: Please don't believe a thing I say or type after this);
1. If you live in an area with a 20% biodiesel blend available - good for you! That seems to be the magic mix with the best lubricity and is actually OEM approved.
2. If you don't have significant or any biodiesel blends available (like me) then additives thar be. Most diesel additives are solvents for cleaning or anti-gel and some claim to also affect the combustion speed (Certane/CN) and/or Lubricity and the associated HFRR/wear scarring test. Oh, for those who have not read their GM Diesel supplement manual nowhere in the owners manual do they state "Please for the love of God use additives to save our engine!".
3. Summer/Winter/"premium" diesel blends which affect Certane and HFRR seem to be items of interest.

But as near as I can tell the longevity of today's ULSD diesel engine is doomed... however that doesn't stop me from wanting to grant eternal life for my 2.8 so if anyone wants to offer me (free of charge along with a coupon for a free engine w/labor) some of the products that did seem to peak my interest based on admitably very limited to no research, I'd like to try:
- Fuel Additives: Liqui Moly Super Diesel Additive AND OR Opti-Lube XPD (RED) - I would use them religiously winter spring summer and fall.
- Oil Additives: Liqui Moly Cerra Tec (please throw in an STP like sticker for old timey sake)
- Oil: Mobile 1 ESP / Liqui Moly Top Tec 4605 / Amalie Elixir 5w-40 (Ok, I'm actually using this now but meh, its oil not made of unicorn tears so I don't expect magic) / any brand recommended by idparts.com

Gee, I hope that helps someone because it didn't help me.